Rosenrot - Rammstein Fan Forum -

I haven't done a lot of research on the subject, but I do get the impression that the guy had a point. I can see, on the one hand, where non-Germans would get the negative stereotypes--but I can also see, from what little I've heard, Germans themselves (on the whole) trying so hard to put that kind of a historical past behind them. We had a guy from there at the store I used to work at, who was (and still is) the ESL teacher for the job-training department there, and it p***ed me off when one of my co-workers out on the production floor would make all sorts of Nazi references in talking to me about the guy. The teacher never even mentioned anything once about it and, moreover, was one of those nice, friendly, hard-working, tolerant and kind types--certainly nothing that would draw fire from anyone. I felt bad for the guy when it came to that co-worker, actually.
I've seen it online, too, especially when checking out music videos on YouTube--heaven forbid you might be interested in or even one of the punk-rock groups. On the other hand, the impression I get is that for Germans (correct me if I'm wrong) the whole thing is a "don't go there" subject. I can understand a certain amount of national shame, considering that it was "their" people who did all that c*ap in the past, but it just seems to me that holding that kind of "we're so sorry about our nationality--please don't hate us" thing I've picked up is just the flip side of the stereotype. At the risk of repeating other people's sentiments, even verbatim, I do have to agree; it's about time they (and everyone else) separate the hatred and bigotry of those years under Hitler from who and what they are as a people and a country now, some sixty-odd years later. I, for one, see "German" as a culture, a nationality, a group of people, even a language--things that can be either positive or negative, depending on who and what comes up. "Nazi", however, refers (in my view) to something very specific, destructive, full of hatred, and not pertaining to how most people there live today. I figure that, as long as any pride in their nationality isn't tied to that or other hatred and intolerance, it's at least harmless and at most something to be embraced. If it takes the example of people like the guys from Rammstein to show others that, then so what. Rock on, guys.

I think Paul is right. I see artists like Rammstein helping Germany move forward by embracing their German roots and refusing to back down to the current political correctness. They are looking to the future, instead of dwelling on the past.

I think Hollywood shares some responsibility for keeping the "all Germans are nazis" myth alive. Don't get me wrong, movies like Schindler's List are important and tell a story that should *never* be forgotten, but the sad fact is that too many people these days are getting all their history lessons from the movies and too often schools are not doing a good job of educating about the past. So, it's not really a surprise that some people see German and nazi as the same thing.

For those who say that we should just forget the third reich because it was so long ago, I have to respectfully disagree. Personally, I'd love it if that happened (I'm a German American myself and proud of my heritage), but I just don't see it happening anytime soon. 60 years does seem like a long time ago, but realistically I think it will take one more generation before Germany will be freed from hitler's curse. There are still too many people alive today who lived through the nightmare of WWII - most of them were kids at the time, but that doesn't
lessen their memories. There are just too many ghosts still walking around. That's not to say that Germany hasn't made some progress already, but it's a long process....one step at a time....


misA.

Well, my mother is half-German, so I guess that makes me a quarter-German
Personally When I think about Germany the first thing that come to my mind isn't the third reich or anything about the Nazis. But I know that most people don't think like me.
What Paul is speaking about reminds me of when I was in Berlin in 2006, I spent 5 months there and had plenty of occasions to speak with German people. In 2006 was the Football world cup in Germany, and many friends I met there told me that it was weird for them to be able to wave German flags and sing the national anthem and stuff like that, without being seen as nazis by foreigners!
One of them told me that it was the first time of his life that he wasn't afraid to be proud of being German!

I think it's sad that people aren't able to be proud of who they are, because of bad things that happened such a long time ago, and by that I don't mean we should forget what happened back then!
From my point of view Germany is now a very open country, with many communities coexisting and (mostly) respecting each others.

aaaaaarhg!!!!!!


http://www.bild.de/BILD/news/bild-engli ... andal.html

Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar..... and a sharp black shirt , a sharp black shirt. Can't believe that they dare to print such rubbish. The"ze"shirts very humiliating not to speak of the picture of Ballack next to Hitler's. Not that's is a very high standard or reliable magazine anyway

Since when does soccer gear equals Hitler? Oh wait, that's right, when Germany makes it to the finals.

On a side note, I hated Germany when I watched them play 4 years ago, but you must understand... they were playing against Portugal..hubby just wouldn't forgive me... I hadn't "discovered" yet at that time so this next world cup just might be different for me this time round, hehe!

The old adage "If it bleeds it leads" in reporting doesn't even come close to this garbage! But then, what do you expect from the likes of a trashy rag? And I thought the National Enquirer was bad - but it doesn't come close to this repulsive nonsense. And the "writer" (I'll use that term lightly) SHOULD apologise.

omg... black shirts = nazi????

Arrgh!!

Re the Newspaper article - I am absolutely sick of the fact that whenever Germany or Germans make it into the news there is a proportion of the British press who use it as an excuse to stir up bigotry and hark back to WWII and Nasizm – particularly anything to do with football. I really think the editors who keep doing this should be prosecuted.
I’m pretty sure that one of the reasons some Germans don’t want to seem ‘too German’, particularly when abroad, is so they don’t provoke exactly this sort of stupid, puerile reaction from a certain proportion of foreign media, and from the (hopefully really small) fraction of people who swallow this garbage and think it is somehow funny to still bring it up in such an infantile manner.

Ironically enough these trashy publications are also exactly the same ones that stir up all the Union Flag/George Cross waving whenever England/GBR does anything, which is one of the reasons I am reticent about saying I’m proud to be British – I’m damn ashamed I live in a country where this sort of stuff is sold as 'news' and definitely don’t want to be associated in any way with such nonsense.

In fact, that article annoyed me so much I've just written to the Press Complaints Comission about it.

thank you all guys

that was huge here in the media but just for an cup of days.
all that i have to say to that kind of garbage is:

Grow Up you silly guy at the magazines!!!!

I think its total bulls that Germans still get viewed in such a negative light. In my opinion, a group of people should not be judged by their (past or recent past) leader. Thats a bit like (obviously not the same) any stereotyping the world does when it comes to Americans based on what George W. Bush did during his presidency. I sincerely hope that we'll all be alive to see the day when not one person thinks "nazi" when they hear anything related to Germany. Well, I'm guessing there might always be a few idiots out there....
There's plenty more I could say on the subject, but I think everyone already seems to have it covered I'd also like to add that I'm quite proud of the fact that I'm two-thirds German...wow thats quite a bit...wonder if that has anything to do w/me being such a big fan of the band & the fact that when I listen to them, I don't just hear the music I feel it too (does that make sense?).....who knows....

I understand what you're saying. I feel the same way sometimes... In a rational world there is no reason I should like this band or this type of music. Perhaps it's some ancient memory in the teutonic DNA calling to us... (well, it *could* be )

misA.

I like that "teutonic dna" theory of yours! It makes sense to me & two-thirds is quite a bit.....

Hmmmm, I'm afraid that theory doesn't stand, I can guarantee there are many people, myself included, that can honestly say they feel the music but have absolutely nothing, not even an ounce, of German DNA running throught their veins. But hey, it must be nice to have yet another way of relating to our German boys.